How to Visualize Your Abstract Future and Turn It From Vision to Reality

with special guest Eva Avenue

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Up Your Creative Genius
How to Visualize Your Abstract Future and Turn It From Vision to Reality

Eva Avenue is an abstract expressionist painter in the East Village, NYC. She has mainly made a living as an editor and writer at newspapers and online publications. She has been publishing an art zine since 2009 called The Nightly Noodle Monthly, produces her own art shows, and is currently working on her debut film project The Art Show Movie. She is co-writing the soundtrack with friends and working a full-time job at The Art Students League of New York. Her dream is to have a storefront studio and bar in Manhattan where she can paint big paintings and have art parties with artist talks as a cultural beacon for voices in the city.


3:06 Growing up with artist parents in Europe

4:30 Moving to Florida, getting an arts education, and starting out as an artist

6:51 The power of visualization, enabling access, and making things happen

9:32 Inheriting her late father’s unfinished paintings and documenting their journey through film

11:09 Riding out the pandemic

13:37 Lessons learnt from living the artist life

14:17 Creating visions, illustrating dreams, and transforming them into reality

18:37 Dealing with self-criticism

19:28 The dynamic, evolving painting process and its unexpected surprises

20:50 Frank O’Cain, abstract expressionism, and why they matter

22:28 Future plans, visions, and dreams

25:29 Daily routines, support networks, and handling saboteurs in life

27:06 Detours and delays in realizing a vision are necessary for growth

28:53 How seeking clarity can help avoid pitfalls and identify unseen opportunities

Social Media


Instagram: @evaavenue

Facebook: Eva Avenue Studio and Spoiled Horse Racer


TikTok: @eva.avenue

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Up Your Creative Genius –

Patti Dobrowolski 00:03

Hello, superstars! Welcome to the Up Your Creative Genius Podcast, where you will gain insight and tips to stomp on the accelerator and blast off to transform your business and your life. I’m your host, Patti Dobrowolski. And if this is your first time tuning in, then strap in – because this is serious rocket fuel. Each week I interview fellow creative geniuses to help you learn how easy it is to Up Your Creative Genius in any part of your life.

Patti Dobrowolski 00:39

Hey, everybody, it’s Patti Dobrowolski. Okay, this is gonna be fun because we were already cracking each other up. Eva Avenue is my guest today. She’s an abstract expressionist painter living in the East Village of New York City, our favorite city in the world. Well, next to Paris, I just want to say. Now listen, she made her living as an editor and writer at newspapers and online magazines. And since 2009, she’s got her own nightly noodle monthly art zine magazine that she posted. It’s incredible. So right now she’s working for the Art Students League in New York City, and she’s working on her first film – The Art Show Movie. She’s getting up walking around right now. I don’t know what she’s doing. But she produces her own shows in any city – she can get one because she’s incredible. And her big dream is to have a storefront – I love this big dream because I always walk by storefronts thinking, “Yes, that’s the place I’ll be”, but she always wants to have a storefront, you know, that’s got a bar in it, and a place where people can meet, filled with big paintings, and art shows, and interesting conversations – to be a beacon for people and voices in this city. Please welcome: Eva Avenue. Whoo! Hey, welcome to the show – so nice to have you here.

Eva Avenue 02:04

So nice to be here. I had gotten up ‘cause someone was calling me during your fantastic intro. And so, yeah, there you go.

Patti Dobrowolski 02:11

I love that, that’s okay – because that’s how we are. We’re all casual in here. And so, I don’t know, where are you? Are you in New York City right now?

Eva Avenue 02:18

I’m in New York right now. And yeah.

Patti Dobrowolski 02:20

Because every so often, like, I’ll see a post from her. And then she’s in St. Pete, Florida. And then she’s in Albuquerque, New Mexico. And then you’ll see her, you know, on Instagram doing these amazing paintings that I’m always like, I want to buy that one. I want to buy that one, and that one, and that one. And so, when you see her artwork, you’re gonna feel exactly the same way, because it’s really beautiful and it really expresses who we are right now. You really are a “right now” kind of person.

Eva Avenue 02:49

Thank you. Yeah, I feel like that.

Patti Dobrowolski 02:51

Yeah, well, and somebody said about you, you’re the most “artist” artist that they know. And I believe that I feel that way too. So tell us a little bit about yourself, so people can get to know you. Where’d you grow up, and how did you become an artist? Or how did that evolve?Eva Avenue 03:06Right? So my proclivity to be an artist kind of came about naturally because I lived many different beautiful places. And both my parents were painters growing up, and so it was just not even a hard thing to slip into doing. Not even on purpose. So I was born in Amsterdam, in an attic, my mom was going to painting school there, my dad had sawed all the legs off the furniture to make this like Amsterdam attic child friendly…and so on the ground it was very Zen. It was very painter-studio and-

Patti Dobrowolski 03:38

kind of the experience. Yeah, I love that. I like that.

Eva Avenue 03:44

And so then…right, we went to Portugal. I was like a year and a half so we moved there where my father was from and, right, so just a lot of painting, a lot of – again that sort of bohemian lifestyle – and, you know, no reason for it, that’s just that’s just what they did. You know, it wasn’t explained to me, “Eva, you know, art is important”, or you know, this is what we’re doing, it’s just what was there. And so by the time we left, my mom left and we came to Florida. I really had this culture shock with these perfectly manicured lawns, I had to wear clothes outside, it was like really bizarre. So, right. I don’t know, I felt, yeah, it was a little jarring, and I don’t want to say like I threw myself into some sort of creative thing, but I do-

Patti Dobrowolski 03:46

You probably were like, Oh my God, where am I? Who am I? How to I find myself? How do I calm myself down?

Eva Avenue 04:30

And so I remember, I might just, but for some reason, my first thought was like, “Can you get me piano lessons?” I asked. My mom was like, I want to take piano. I remember someone mentioning, on our way, like leaving Portugal, I was playing some sort of, you know, these metal keys and someone said: “She’s really good,” and I thought, “I am really good.” (laughs) Like yeah, this sounds like a succession of correct notes. And I thought that was fun and so, right. So I, yeah. So living in Florida, taking piano lessons, you know, just writing poetry, drawing – you know, that was sort of what I did well at and in school. And, you know, there was, you know, not some sort of family thing where, you know, it was weird to want to be an artist, even though there’s-

Patti Dobrowolski 05:03

No, because your parents were artists, I don’t think I knew that about you. That’s fantastic.

Eva Avenue 05:21Yeah!

Patti Dobrowolski 05:22

So you were allowed to express yourself in any way you wanted to.

Eva Avenue 05:26

I was, right. And so I just kept doing that. And then I enrolled to an Art High School, and I got more training. And so the – you know, the underbelly of that is being financially illiterate, and not really having a sense of how certain real world processes work. Yes. So, you know, I ended up with student debt, going to school, you know, I got a full ride to MICA – the Maryland Institute College of Art, it was my first choice, but they didn’t have a full scholarship. So I went to New Mexico, and my mom really wanted me to go to school, you know – on my own, I might have just painted and seen what could happen that way and ended up in the city like that. But you know what – it worked out. I learned how to write well, and I did make a living off of what I went to college for, which was, you know, editing and writing and sort of arts journalism, because I thought: you know, what, if you’re gonna make it on your own, you have to know how to write, you have to know-

Patti Dobrowolski 05:52


Eva Avenue 05:53

talk to people, and you know, it’s just like, a good skill to have. So yeah, I kind of was just gathering all these things and taking um, you know, music composition, and African dance, and ballet, and French and like, comedy writing, and I just had a really great time in college. So, yeah, I kind of just by miracle of sheer will have been able to sustain the life I’ve been living my whole life with, you know, pockets of hardship, or a little something, it feels like a detour. But in the end, you realize it wasn’t-

Patti Dobrowolski 06:49

Yes, yes.

Eva Avenue 06:51

Right. And so but a big part of what I’ve done is visualization. And I have always understood – before I met you – that there was this kind of, yeah, there was like a currency beyond economics, that could be like, you know, brought up-

Patti Dobrowolski 07:05


Eva Avenue 07:06

Yeah, there’s something else you can access and activate, even if you don’t have money. And sometimes you- and I think the people that discover this are the people that have to find another way to make that thing happen, right?

Patti Dobrowolski 07:15

That’s right, that’s right.

Eva Avenue 07:16

You have to discover like, you know, what’s the, you know, where’s the book of spells, and everyone’s looking for their own book of spells? And so Patti, you’re a big- Right, you’re a big, yeah, spell chapter when I found you. It was, it was pretty great. Anyway, so here I am on your podcast. This is so-

Patti Dobrowolski 07:16

I love it. Well, one of the things that I wonder about- so, when you grew up with a couple of parents who are painters, you know, were they critical about your painting at all? Did they give you feedback about it? Did they let you just express yourself? Or how did they encourage you, or not? I’m curious, like, I don’t know, if my parents were painters, or illustrators, if I would have ever drawn, you know, I might have been worried about how the picture looked.

Eva Avenue 07:59

So my mom would give tips when I asked, or if she felt moved to point out, you know, how to do a simple trick to achieve a visual effect, but she did not really sit me down and like give me art lessons. I always kind of had them – the supplies were there and she would like, you know, she would drag me into her, you know, anatomy class for the portrait sections. And I would say, I was just always immersed in it, I’d go to these art shows. And so, yeah, usually if I asked, but I think she was just happy I was doing it. So she wasn’t trying to crowd me. And then my dad was just, you know, one of those critical, you know, hard to please. You know, it’s why she left – I went back again in Portugal in 18 to see him again, I remember his friends coming to visit, and I could see him being visibly annoyed when they would joke that I was better than him – but I don’t know how much. I was like I really wanted to do – He like set up this canvas. This was in the south of Portugal. And he was like – in Portuguese, he didn’t speak English – he’s like, show me, you know, show me what you can do. So I made this beautiful painting. And I made it with some green in there, because I remember he would say that like, green’s a hard color to paint – but it was mostly blue and yellow. I remember chopping up the green to blue and yellow to its pure states because those two make green and so, yeah, it was like this beach in this desert. And these people like carrying these gourds and – so but I just remember it annoying him that I was better.

Patti Dobrowolski 09:30

that you were better. Yeah, that you were better.

Eva Avenue 09:32

But not necessarily better. But because he made really beautiful work that tourists love, like, he’s like the moon on the water and the thing, but right, maybe that was more absurd. Maybe he wasn’t so…imaginative. Maybe they were out of his imagination, I don’t know. But the funny thing is, so this art show movie I’m making – which is in lieu of a solo abstract show I was going to have but COVID shut it down – so, I’m making this movie instead, and my sister in Portugal just sent four paintings over that my dad had made – you know, he died in 2006. And, they’re for me to finish, they’re like, unfinished.

Patti Dobrowolski 10:02


Eva Avenue 10:03

It’s all, it’s kind of beautiful. And so I, I still haven’t picked them up because A) it’s intense for me and B) I want to film going over there and getting them.

Patti Dobrowolski 10:12

Yeah, as part of this movie.

Eva Avenue 10:13

Yeah. And then the movie will culminate in an actual physical art show. And so I would like to have those paintings in there that my dad did, that I finished – one of them. I don’t think I will, I think I’ll just leave it as it is – but yeah, it’s-

Patti Dobrowolski 10:24

Wow, that is so great. So when we met, and then COVID happened – or maybe we met during COVID, I can’t remember – but, what I do know is that you started to make this movie, The Art Show Movie. And I can’t wait for that. Because the way that your brain works is just incredible. I mean, you are always piecing together new ideas, and they’re just exploding. And so, for you to have that vision of what it will be, and then also, you’re really a big, ginormous risk taker. I think, as an artist, I mean, you’ll just move to a city and then you’re just going to do it. you’re going to figure out how it’s going to go. And so tell me, you were recently in Albuquerque, what were you doing there?

Eva Avenue 11:09

I was riding out the pandemic and painting for the show I had gotten. So I, initially when I got this show – and it was right before the pandemic it was finalized, and around the time I met you, although I had known your work beforehand. So yeah, I wanted to paint anyway. The pandemic hit, my work went remote. And suddenly I could go out west, where I used to live and work on these large paintings because it’s hard to paint and a little like-

Patti Dobrowolski 11:34

Yeah, in a studio apartment or one bedroom apartment, right?

Eva Avenue 11:38

Which, which I’m back in the city, but whatever. But I have so much space-

Patti Dobrowolski 11:42

When you get that big storefront space, right? Spread out, and the big paintings – I can’t wait.

Eva Avenue 11:49

Yeah, that’s the dream, which is you know, back in the day, you see this beautiful pictures of these abstract expressionists in the 40s and 50s here in New York, and they had all these, these big warehouse spaces, because they’re-

Patti Dobrowolski 11:57

Even in the 70s. I mean, even if you look at those, you know, you can see this space in that movie. And I’m thinking, no, yeah, that’s-

Eva Avenue 12:06

It’s not like that scrappy city as much anymore. You really have to have money to buy it. And so thank God, I married someone with good credit. So I couldn’t- I was thinking because before last time I moved here, I even had a snake in my room. And it was just like, like, Man, this is a lot. So but yeah, that’s what I found your videos when I was looking-

Patti Dobrowolski 12:21

Yeah, well, when you went to New Mexico, and then you just painted for the show itself, and created all the work. How many paintings did you do for the show?

Eva Avenue 12:33

I have, like, I guess about 10. And I’m currently working on more because the longer this movie is taking, the higher my standards are, and the bigger my dreams for how this looks. So-

Patti Dobrowolski 12:48

That’s okay. I was just asking you about how many paintings, but I was curious about how many paintings are in a typical show, like the one you did in New Mexico? How many were in that show?

Eva Avenue 12:59

So I’ve had shows in New Mexico, there is not a show that I didn’t-

Patti Dobrowolski 13:02

Okay, so you went there to create the movie. Ah, I get it, I get it.

Eva Avenue 13:06

I brought them with me to New York – I still have the work, I’m still working on the show. And so I mean, I’ve sent them like a large number of like, smaller abstract ones. And I’m now working on it. It’s not abstract, but I meant to make it abstract. Now, I accidentally have this portrait of Fran Lebowitz and Dr. Dre because they’re both ruthless and the baby’s called Ruthless.

Patti Dobrowolski 13:24

Fantastic. I love that. Yeah. I love that now. And then, what, how do you make money? Do you sell your artwork? Can you do it specifically with that now? Or how do you make a living as an artist really? What have you learned?

Eva Avenue 13:37

I – Yeah, I’ve learned that it is such hard work. It’s just really hard work unless you get lucky but, I mean, it’s either hard work and then you know, nothing – or it’s hard work and then you get lucky. So, we’re gonna slow climb – you know, there’s many ways to go about it, but yeah, I do work jobs. It’s so, right now the financials of what I do is more hobby status because I get – I’d make sporadic sales because I’m not so concentrated on it. But, I do work at the Art Students League of New York, which is, like, if I can’t be at the Yale School of Painting –

Patti Dobrowolski 14:12

I was gonna say like, that is like the most incredible place to be, right?

Eva Avenue 14:17

So basically every artist from New York and from outside of New York who had to use a, you know, as a way to study in the States went through there. Everyone, except Andy Warhol – but his nephew did go there. You know, we got Paula, we got Georgia O’Keeffe. I mean, just everyone went through there. And so to be in those walls, to be there, you know – with access to the teachers, being able to take classes there, just meeting all these New Yorkers and just being able to talk with my artistically minded coworkers. It’s, I feel like I’m in a nucleus, like a little nucleus, like I just knew everybody. And so, right in there’s people I want to interview for the show and I’m thinking like, how can I, you know, use the League for part of this movie? So yeah, the paintings are getting bigger, the dreams getting bigger. You know, I’m working on a soundtrack for it. And it’s, you know, so much visualization went into this, I can’t even – I thought I’d be like, you know, talking about sort of all these little points, but then, you know, I just want to tell you what happened. And it’s like getting into how I even brought all this stuff about. But, I mean, everything has been a drawing. Like, I made a vision board about moving to Manhattan, which is just so hard. It was so expensive, and it’s just the, but the COVID pricing made it happen. And so-

Patti Dobrowolski 15:24

So you were able to- so you drew it in a picture.

Eva Avenue 15:27

Yeah, all the cool stuff I make happen, I drew in a picture, visualized it, or I made a collage for it. And yes, just either – and either like how you say, you know, your brain guesses its way to an outcome, it’ll either be like that, or the picture will solidify the thing in my mind so I don’t give up on it. Like when I get this art show, and it was in Ireland and I was coming up with a lot of like, obstacles, but it was that drawing I made that I learned from you, that just counts like, I have like, no, I’m not gonna let that drawing down. I’m not gonna let that vision down. And it just works so well.

Patti Dobrowolski 15:58

Yeah, well, I think as an artist, you know, you already understand the power of the visual, and that the visual just unfolds for you, and the painting evolves. And so, I don’t know what your process as an artist is. And so, maybe you can speak to that. But what I do know is that, when you have that picture, you said it solidified it, and it made it so that you wanted it to happen. And those things – that’s part of that magical energy you were talking about earlier. And your parents did it, right? And your mom moved from Portugal to the US, right? To Florida and did that. And part of that is, you know, trust and will and grit, and going forward with the vision of you as an artist, right?

Eva Avenue 16:45

That’s right. And so, yup, the fact that we’re bringing this up, I’m thinking about something I wanted to tell you I read in Jensen’s History of Art. It’s this like, tome of just the world’s history of art, starting with cave paintings. And I read something and I immediately thought of you because it talks about the Lascaux cave paintings. So they’re hidden away, they’re not accessible by some casual intruder at the mouth of the cave, but they are put back because of the the ritual involved in the power. And so they would make these realistic, you know, big game animals as a part of a magic ritual to ensure a successful hunt. Now, so when the climate started to warm up a bit, and they start to head north, the animals start to head north, they shift from like, ensuring a killing of a hunt to literally drawing these paintings, these animals in the cave, and trying to get as realistic as possible, because they think they’re now bringing them like into existence. They are making more animals, they’re not drawing a distinction between an image and reality. To them, it’s kind of the same. And I’m like, that’s literally what Patti was talking about. And it’s just like this. It’s just amazing to see this thread from the dawn of, of humanity, like, and it’s, you know, you can repackage it, but it’s kind of the same approach.

Patti Dobrowolski 16:47

Yeah, it is. Well, and I think people don’t- they underestimate the power of drawing something, you know, and the fact that it’s part of your DNA. It’s your heritage, that you were some time – and you know, if you believe in, you know, evolution, you evolved from that. So somewhere in your cellular structure is a portion of you that can draw, if you can get the critic out of the way, right, right, then it’s much more powerful. How did you learn to get your critic out of the way? What do you do when you start to feel critical about what you’re doing?

Eva Avenue 18:37

I remember in high school feeling very insecure and weird and self-conscious. And then I remember having this sort of breakthrough moment where I realized everyone felt that way. Like, people are too busy thinking about themselves and their shortcomings to maybe judge me. And if they aren’t, then I don’t know. Maybe they’re a little bit like, oh, snaky, and I don’t need them around. (laughs) So, I don’t know, from there, I kind of just relaxed and you know, I remember appreciating when other people would mess up in front of the public eye, because I remember not judging them. I just remember feeling more relaxed within myself. And so I thought, you know, what, if you’re messing up, like, just, that’s fine. And so yeah, I just really haven’t worried about how I look too much in public with uh-

Patti Dobrowolski 19:23

Well, well, and also with your art, you know, that’s part of it. Is that you?

Eva Avenue 19:27

It’s a big part.

Patti Dobrowolski 19:28

Yeah, you evolve. Do you evolve within the painting itself, the process within itself? Or do you have a set idea of what you’re going to paint and you sketch it out with a pencil? And then you go from there, but then does it evolve? If that’s the case, how does it – how do you approach it?

Eva Avenue 19:44

It evolves even if you have it sketched out. So, much like the drawings I do for visualization, and I started keep coming back to it, but that is what you’re about. And so yeah, I’ve noticed that like with visualization, drawings, or posters, it doesn’t always come out exactly how you put it, whether it’s like one specific picture, like many things like- so there’s always this sort of margin of, you know, the unexpected outcome of what your dream ends up looking like. There’s the unexpected outcome of what the painting ends up looking like, and it’s always kind of a surprise. And it’s always a little, yeah, it’s, it’s kind of fun. Because I mean, if you are just trying to recreate what you see, and you succeed at that, then that’s fine. And that’s great. And there’s a market for it. But I just feel like it’s a little bit more exciting. It’s a little bit more rock and roll to just sort of like-

Patti Dobrowolski 20:33

let it evolve and let it be what it is, I think. And then do you have, you know, other painters? I know you do probably at the Art League, but do you have any other painters in your life or other artists that really influence you and impact you? Who are your role models in a way?

Eva Avenue 20:50

My role models are…

Patti Dobrowolski 20:54

Or who do you / are you interested in right now that you think, oh, that is so cool, what they’re doing – like that?

Eva Avenue 21:01

Frank O’Cain – who I’m taking a class from right now – comes from this lineage that started the school of abstract expressionism in New York, and like, and the lineage goes back to Europe. So when you’re somewhere in the country, and you think you’re making an abstract painting, and you’re thinking that you’re just expressing a thing, you might not realize there’s this very solid, like, coming about and process of thinking that made abstract expressionism possible. I mean, it’s such a thing. And it’s like a pearl of an oyster of a lot of discussion, a lot of turf wars. And the CIA, actually, at one point, was helping fund these art shows by the Abstract Expressionists because it seemed like an anti-Russian thing to invest in – because it was about, like, free thought. And it was like-

Patti Dobrowolski 21:49

Oh, wow, doesn’t that sound just so like the CIA? That is so crazy, wow!

Eva Avenue 21:55

It is. And so you think it’s these shapes on a canvas – and you just learned it’s so much more. I mean, it’s a national identity that, yeah, I mean, it’s a lot. So yeah, I’m currently getting more kind of serious when it comes to abstract work that is more like committing to a form of committing something as solid beyond just expressing something that I think is a good composition, which is part of it. But yeah, so I’m really nerding out on the, yeah, growing as an abstract artist-

Patti Dobrowolski 22:22

No, I like that, actually. It’s interesting. I think that because if you’re not an artist, you don’t understand sometimes where you see people do a painting, and you think, hmm where they get that? Or where they get that idea, or how did they, especially an abstract expressionist painter, is a very unique stream of painting, right? It’s not a realism. It’s just such a free form, in and of itself. And so even if it has people in it, and things in it, it really is the composition is about that. And so – that freedom, and I could see why the CIA would want to study that and follow that. But it seems like a non sequitur to me, you know, like, that’s not the right word, but it just doesn’t seem to match up.

Eva Avenue 22:24It’s surprising, yeah, information.

Patti Dobrowolski 22:28

Yeah. And when you when you think about yourself, and what you want to do, like when you envision the future, what’s on your future map now? Where do you see yourself? Is part of it the storefront studio, where you got these big paintings and stuff like that, but what else?

Eva Avenue 23:26

Yeah. Well, so I see myself in like a high collaborative editorial place where people come to me for creative collaboration – if they want a certain, like, vibe on a photo shoot. I do like to get out and do these, like extracurricular sort of projects, which I do.

Patti Dobrowolski 23:46

You do all these weird things, yes you do.

Eva Avenue 23:48

But then yeah, I do want to have like a –

Patti Dobrowolski 23:50

Give an example of one when you say that, so people know what extracurricular activities, what would that be? Like you standing in front, interviewing people – what is it?

Eva Avenue 24:00

I would love to play Joan Mitchell – the abstract painter, in Amy Sherman-Palladino’s upcoming project – she’s supposedly doing you know, she did Marvelous Mrs. Maisel. She’s turning Ninth Street women about these abstract expressionists, the women there into this film and I’m like, how cool would that be, right? Or how cool it’d be if Wes Anderson called me up and was like, you know, we want to give this like, the Eva vibe on like, the backdrops – like can you help with the backdrops or like, to be in just one of his films is like an artist character. Like, I feel like I, yes, just-

Patti Dobrowolski 24:34

Yes, yes, you definitely could do that. What I love about this – and so if anybody out there knows this person, I want you to connect her to them – because this is how the universe works. You just put it out there. So we’re going to just see if we can manifest that because, you know, what’s fascinating to me about what you do and who you are, is – you’re always wacky, you’re just doing some wild things. Even when you were coming through Denver, we didn’t know each other at all. She shows up in these hot pants in my house, I’ve got these contractors, they’re like, just totally scoping her. They can’t like, take their eyes off of her. I’m like, get back to work. And we’re just having this chat. And it’s fantastic. You know, I mean, you really are an artist artist. You really are. And so I’m curious, when you – what’s your day look like, from start to finish? What’s it look like, a typical day?

Eva Avenue 25:29

Well, when I wake up, I check on Zelenskyy. Is he still alive? How’s he doing? I make coffee. I take the train to work. I’m there all day, I come home, where I just either, you know, work on one of my projects, or, you know, pass out or have dinner with my husband, who I also met through drawings that I did using your method. So good. And then-

Patti Dobrowolski 25:56

Well, when he’s such an – he’s an artist himself, so you know, I mean, he’s just an incredible person.

Eva Avenue 26:02Yeah, no, yeah. I mean, if – I’d heard, you know, to be successful, you need to have a supportive partner. Like, that’s one of the things for success. And I was like, well, I really don’t have that ever. What I really have are saboteurs of my life, who come and suck me dry and then are so rude. (laughs) Like, it’s just like, yeah, I need to like really solidify my foundation so I can operate on a higher kind of plane where I’m not constantly having to like pick myself up again, which was, you know, sort of another like underbelly-

Patti Dobrowolski 26:32

Well, and you drew a picture with him in it. That was how we met – is that you watched that TED video, you drew a picture of your husband, then somehow you contacted me to tell me that what you had drawn showed up in your real life. Your husband.

Eva Avenue 26:47


Patti Dobrowolski 26:47

You married him. And it hadn’t been that long that you were married to him that you contacted me.

Eva Avenue 26:52

Yeah, yeah, it took a year. And I remember you saying in the TED Talk, like, “Oh it’ll take about a year”, and it took a year. And I was just like, that is a genius. What is happening? So anyway, yeah. So-

Patti Dobrowolski 27:02

it just lodged in there. And then you took it as truth, that’s all.

Eva Avenue 27:06

Yeah. So since then, some things will take less than a year, some things will take more for you. Like I did this drawing like two years ago to like, clear my student loans. It’s now been two years, but some take longer. So I’m still going through that. But yeah, so then the weekends, that’s when I like, have time to work on my projects. So I’m either, yeah, painting or reading or, you know, playing guitar, my little honeycomb comb…tome…HoneyTone amp – and it’s very cute, I love it. Yeah, but this full time job is new. So usually, when I would have that job, where I was working from, like remotely doing social media for coffee, I could just – I was traveling, I was staying with friends. I was like, creating artist residences for me. And so this is, yeah, I love the job. I love where I’m at. And I hope to eventually go back to a place where I do have more time. Yeah.

Patti Dobrowolski 27:53

And what’s true is that, you know, you said earlier, you said, you know, sometimes you move forward in this trajectory of getting your vision, and then sometimes you kind of have a detour. And to me, this is like the change Genie detour card, right? That in the weather that you might encounter in your life, you got a detour. However, this was an essential detour for you as an artist. And so I’m fascinated by that, because that tells me you’re on the right track to stepping into even more into your greatness, and being seen and known for the beautiful work that you do. Because, honestly, people, it’s beautiful. You know, there are painters, and she’s just incredible – so, you have to check out her work. Now, tell me, Eva, if you were going to give advice to anybody about how they could pivot, how they get through, you know, and the highs and lows of what their experience is, what would you say? What are your tips?Eva Avenue 28:53I’d say, do whatever you can to get really clear. That’s a great basis, like and I mean, like, if you just noticed that maybe you are really stuck on something or it just, you know, physically or mentally or emotionally, I think it’s really good to be clear, because then you do have the space to, yeah, go forward on these pivots. But when you’re clear, you also can pay more attention to hunches. You know, you can recognize a wave, you know, you’re like a surfer, you want you want to hop a wave, right? So if you’re too scared, if you’re sitting on the beach, like oh my god, I don’t, like I can’t tell the wave like, so you got to recognize these waves. And like, so just a quick example – I really wanted to work remotely. That was so important to me. I mean, that’s really a dream, right?

Patti Dobrowolski 29:39Yeah.

Eva Avenue 29:40

And I did not have a remote job. And I just got this like idea in my head, I don’t know why, I just thought – there’s this coffee shop called Janeiro’s in St. Pete, and she wasn’t doing very well. And I was like, I’m just gonna offer to do a mural, a very, very big mural. And i’m not gonna ask for money and I’m just gonna do it, and it was completely irrational. Why would I, I don’t know, but I offered it, she gave it to me. One year later, you know, after I made that drawing, okay, so I did that like half year later, I moved to New York, I do that drawing that you had done, that the, my husband-

Patti Dobrowolski 30:09

Draw your Future with your husband, yeah-

Eva Avenue 30:11

Right. And so, like a year, and then I eventually moved back to St. Pete to make this album. And it was that painting I had done of the coffee farmers in this coffee shop, where an interview I had – someone had set up for me, like just called me out of the blue like, hey, like they need this social media person. And so I met her like down the road from where that mural was. And at the end, I said, Hey, I want to show you something. And she goes in, and she sees this depiction of literally – literally, what is the core brand message of the company, right? Like, like Fairtrade, like pro-farmer, and I have these farmers, it’s very uplifting, and she was like, what – I mean, that’s a pretty big sign like, hire this girl, right? So you just have to like, you have to-

Patti Dobrowolski 30:51

Follow your hunch, yeah.

Eva Avenue 30:52

You have to follow it, you have to do something to start driving it forward. So yeah, you have to-

Patti Dobrowolski 30:58

That’s interesting – drive it forward to move it.

Eva Avenue 31:01

Yeah, you have to drive the thing forward. So even if it’s not landing an interview, if it’s just like, yeah, putting a picture up, or you know, just getting an outfit that you would wear in this sort of situation – just doing something to start to shift your life toward that. And you have to, you know, kind of keep it like a big vision, because it’s not going to happen immediately all the time. But, you know, sometimes you feel like you might be deserving of that because you see social media, and everyone’s got so easy on social media, why can’t you have it too easy too? But it’s not. It’s not.

Patti Dobrowolski 31:28

Yeah, no, I love that. It’s really not true. I think that, you know, look at how old I am, it’s still not true. Sometimes it’s not true, you really have to work – you have to. And we talked just briefly about grit, how grit is essential to you moving yourself forward. So you have a big picture vision of where you want to go, and then you pay attention to your hunches about what you should do, and then you do that. And then later, you see: maybe a year later, you see the link between the two things and what has happened. And you know, I think everybody – I don’t know about you, but I think everybody’s cycle of manifestation is very different. But, you can accelerate things, and you can inspire yourself by having that picture – and that is the whole point of it. There’s no other reason to be doing it, except that it fills you with dopamine, you know, it makes you feel high, like you’re capable and confident – you’re suddenly you know, super person, you “There you go! You’re gonna be able to do it”, and you get your cape on, and then you go out and you do these weird things – and they all link up at the end. And so, you know, I think when I think about you, and just, you’re growing up now that I know that and now you’re at the Art League, you know, and that you’re constantly learning and trying to do different things and stretch yourself. These two are other ways that tips of how you can be bigger in the world. Because it’s not about you getting to the end result, I think people think, you know, it’s all about making it, whatever making it looks like and trust me, every moment is making it. And I know that from watching you, because every moment you appreciate whatever it is – and you post that appreciation, so we can see it. And it’s not always pretty, it’s not always perfect – but it is appreciating the moment. And so, thank you for that.

Eva Avenue 33:32

Thank you for that. That’s, I guess I do do that – I feel so connected. Yeah. (laughs)

Patti Dobrowolski 33:38

Well, that’s fantastic. Well, I can’t wait to have you back.

Eva Avenue 33:41

I can’t wait to come back!

Patti Dobrowolski 33:42

After we’ve learned – whatever the, I mean, like in a year, I want you to come back on this very day in a year so that we could see what happened from here and to see whether you get in that movie or not – I don’t care. I think you should!

Eva Avenue 33:55Yes!

Patti Dobrowolski 33:56

I’m saying it’s gonna happen.

Eva Avenue 33:57

Whoo! Then I pay off my student loans, let’s see what happens, in what year.

Patti Dobrowolski 34:01

That’s right. Will you be in that movie? Will they ask you to do the backdrops? Who cares? Will you be an artist? In that, that set of that – that would be fantastic. And will your movie be complete? I’m sure it will. So, I love you so much, and thank you for spending time with everybody. Oh gosh, thanks for being-

Eva Avenue 34:17

I love you too, so much. Thank you for having me on this podcast. It’s always good to see you and I’m happy that I could share my story with everyone. Yeah,

Patti Dobrowolski 34:24

Me too. Thanks again. Alright everybody, you know the drill – you definitely want to connect with Eva Avenue. You want to follow her, you want to see her beautiful paintings and then you want to buy one, and then you want to go on with your day and take some of her tips and apply them. And then, you know, forward this to your friends if you liked the podcast, and send us a note just to tell us what you thought was incredible about this experience. So, I can’t wait to see you again! And so until next time, Up Your Creative Genius and I mean it – I mean it.

Patti Dobrowolski 35:00

Thanks so much for listening today. Be sure to DM me on Instagram your feedback or takeaways from today’s episode on Up Your Creative Genius. Then join me next week for more rocket fuel. Remember, you are the superstar of your universe and the world needs what you have to bring – so get busy! Get out, and Up Your Creative Genius. And no matter where you are in the universe, here’s some big love from yours truly, Patti Dobrowolski and the Up Your Creative Genius podcast. That’s a wrap!

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